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| Stranglehold77 |
 Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2004 10:51 am |
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ORDER OF THE SKULL
Joined: 10 Apr 2002
Posts: 5437
Location: Victoria BC CANADA
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| steve is right on the money with vinyl inks. Nothing but trouble. Too bad I have to work with it every day. I can feel a case of cancer coming on. Anyways, I too started in my basement. The more screenboys, the better. |
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STIFF HOMBRE!!!!! |
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| stoney66 |
| Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2004 12:30 pm |
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Joined: 05 Jul 2004
Posts: 209
Location: Cola, SC
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hey Steve - thanks for the input you are putting forth here....
I'm getting into screening for the first time myself. I have a small deck company that is comming up, we are going to try and screen our own boards within the next couple of months.
I already have a screen built (255mesh count), however have not ordered any chemicals yet.
I was looking at using Nazdar 9700 for my boards, but now that you mention the GV series...what's the difference w/ those? Also do you know if either of those inks will have a problem adhering to a deck that has already been sealed?
thanks again,
~Larry |
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| Homer80 |
| Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2004 12:45 pm |
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Joined: 15 Jun 2004
Posts: 1386
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If your going to print on shirts with air dry ink keep in mind that you can only do dark ink on light colored shirts ( if someone can turn me on to an opaque air dry ink that dosnt crack or look like shit I'll be your best friend  ) I would also suggest getting some clamps and making a machine. You'll be able to crank out the shirts then. If you want to screen black shirts ( for some reason most people want black shirts) you'll have to use plastisol ink with at least a flash dryer. This is as far as I've gotten thinking I know how to silkscreen. I bought a flash dryer got the white ink, screen cleaner even reducer. All of a sudden I'm back to square one making a mess and smelling up my house. |
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In a country full of Neanderthals? I wear it as a fucking badge of honor!"
Rainbow Randolph Death to Smoochie |
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| DunnDiego |
| Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2004 1:20 pm |
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Joined: 12 Jul 2003
Posts: 2817
Location: San Diego
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| Hey, thanks for the info Homer. I'm doing some Black on white shirts now, but was planning on doing white on black next. Looks like I'll have to investigate a little further first. |
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| newrepublicsteve |
| Posted: Sun Nov 21, 2004 12:32 am |
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Joined: 13 Nov 2004
Posts: 674
Location: Birmingham
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I am having my decks printed by mimic until after I move
I can't afford to invest in new screens and inks at this point
and I like for my products to be done as well as possible
I have tested the gv on some boards I had laying around, and I didn't like the outcome, felt a little rough and textured
pretty much I am looking at the 9700 series myself
the gv series is designed especially for printing on vinyl where as the 9700 is multi purposue including wood....
you could always contact nazdar and ask them what they recommend
as for printing on darks...
plastisol is it sorry guys
but for you guys starting out and who cant afford a flash drier
you can get a heat gun from home depot for like 30.00
heats to about 1000 degrees
we used one for these for about 6 monthes
and we still use it to flash longsleeves and trucker hats
the problem withthe heat gun
well it melt a shirt in about 30 seconds of direct heat...
you have to keep it moving at al ltimes and and you can never be quite sure if you have reached the magic temp of 320 to reach a full cure...
but with a little practice and few scorched or under cured shirts you'll figure it
atleast enough to sell a few shirts and by a flash dryer |
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| Homer80 |
| Posted: Sun Nov 21, 2004 2:36 am |
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Joined: 15 Jun 2004
Posts: 1386
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| I got the flash dyer. When I went to plastisol inks thats when I found out I don't silkscreen right. What a mess. |
_________________
How does it feel to be voted the most hated man in America?
In a country full of Neanderthals? I wear it as a fucking badge of honor!"
Rainbow Randolph Death to Smoochie |
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| newrepublicsteve |
| Posted: Sun Nov 21, 2004 2:14 pm |
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Joined: 13 Nov 2004
Posts: 674
Location: Birmingham
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| if you can be more specific about what you are having problems with we might be able to walk you thru them.... |
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| Homer80 |
| Posted: Sun Nov 21, 2004 3:34 pm |
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Joined: 15 Jun 2004
Posts: 1386
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defstarsteve wrote: if you can be more specific about what you are having problems with we might be able to walk you thru them....
Thanks I will when I have time to type it out. I think it might be a good read for this forum. |
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How does it feel to be voted the most hated man in America?
In a country full of Neanderthals? I wear it as a fucking badge of honor!"
Rainbow Randolph Death to Smoochie |
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| Homer80 |
| Posted: Sun Nov 21, 2004 9:15 pm |
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Joined: 15 Jun 2004
Posts: 1386
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Normally I use air dry inks with my homemade unit. The inks are fairly smooth in consistanly (like ketchup). I can lay the shirts down on top of the platen without spary abheasive or anything else. The screen lays directly on top of yhe shirt (solid contact). I apply some ink and spread it out with my extremely hard squeege. After the image is covered with ink I begin to work the ink off the area with the squeege until I can see the detail then the print is usually done. I lift the screen and if I missed a spot no problem I get no lift from the shirt and I can let the screen down and cover the area I missed.
Now , with the plastisol ( Union brand white) right out of the can the stuff is really thick.I dont think anything of that, I do tie the shirt down with an elastic to hold it in place just in case. At this point I think with plastisol I can rescreen over and over ( using the flash dryer) until the ink is bright enough. Well to my suprise the shirt sticks to the screen like glue, and pulls up even after I had tied it down. So my next step is to get some reducer, and an extra long allen wrench for my electric drill to mix the ink.
So I thin the ink and the I whip it up real good with the drill and I tie the shirt down even better. the shirt still sticks to the screen. Well after a little more research I find out the screen should not make contact with the shirt,the shirt should be glued down with spray abheasive and my squeege must be almost the width of the screen. And I have to go out and by this book " How to silkscreen for fun and profit".
I was very dissapointed. I thought I was just getting to the next level and I pretty much found out most of what I was doing was wrong. Now I could have PMed you with the problems but I think most of the people on this forum are fairly new to screening and would benifit from it. Thanks for any advise in this matter. |
_________________
How does it feel to be voted the most hated man in America?
In a country full of Neanderthals? I wear it as a fucking badge of honor!"
Rainbow Randolph Death to Smoochie |
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| newrepublicsteve |
| Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2004 12:00 am |
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Joined: 13 Nov 2004
Posts: 674
Location: Birmingham
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well
I haven't used water based inks in a long time, like 8 years, so I don't feel comfortable giving you advise on them...
but plastisol...
whoever gave you that info was correct
your ink should be smooth and spread like melting butter when you print with them.... but you don't want to thin it so much that it doesn't cure correctly, this come with practice
you want a thin coat in one direction if at all possible...
spray tack...yup, gotta have it and off contact is almost more important then anything else....
I might alos recommend a flood coat, and I'll explain why
the emulsion sits on the mesh of screen, you are not really filling the holes of the screen with emulsion when you coat it but you are creating a thin layer that sits on top of it... when you print you actaully fill the emulsion layer with ink and not the screen, the screen is there to contro lthe amount of ink.
you will notice that it is harder to coat a low mesh screen then a high mesh, the reason for which is well there is more open surface area to coat and also when you print the lower mesh (60-155) you get thicker amounts of ink them if you print higher (200-355) the reason for thicker cots of ink is the thicker coat of emulsion....
the reason for a flood coat is to fill the screen with ink in the opposite direction of which you print, so it makes it a fuller smoother and easier print.
when you make a print the ink is supposed to sit on the surface of the garment and not be pushed deep into the shirt....
the off contact allows for you to sheer the ink off the surface of screen and onto the surcace of the shirt
the deeper you push ink into the shirt the more the shirt color will show through the intial pass, and the more you will need to flash to make the ink opaque....
I don't know how you genrally print but I almost always pull for my flood coat and use a push stroke for my print...
an old printer, with like 40 years in the business told me that you should use a push... bascially it's better for your wrists, arms and back...
kind of the theory of what is easier to push a car, or pull it,
I don't know if I helped or not but if i can think of anymore info I willadd it and if you have more queations please ask |
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