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| skinny |
 Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 4:06 pm |
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Joined: 12 Sep 2004
Posts: 2706
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| Ha ha, Boo hoo. I see it like this. The only way any us manufacturer can keep themselves in business is by dabbling in shop/blank decks. Their other options are taking on indy brands for oem production. "Don't buy a shop deck, but my "bro" works for the guys who are making shitty quality decks with a pros name on it, so its ok to buy those Chinese made decks." In fact most of the shop decks on the western United States come from over seas manufacturing and are screen printed here. This is a tactic I don't endorse but I won't say stop buying shop decks. The fact is before I was a skateboard maker I was a skateboard rider, I would have liked the option to buy a cheaper deck. The kids buy them knowing that the quality is lower but they don't care cause they are going to ride that thing until it dies. Fuck the pros! I know a few of todays top pros, in fact some have ridden or still ride for the big guys in China. I like these people but I could definately see them broke as fuck and not feel sorry for them. Now on the other hand, I might shed a tear for someone who invests time and money trying to make a skateboard company work, only to be pushed under by companies who pay people to be fuckin rock star wannabes. The companies that took your money as a kid would laugh at your morals that aren't even based in reality. Skateboarding has no code of ethics. |
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| ThrashCan |
| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 4:26 pm |
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Joined: 16 Mar 2004
Posts: 1331
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Not to bash mimic, they're good people but somethin just isnt right there. I think some corners are being cut, the wood isnt very stiff and I have had two 6ply decks come from them.
anyway...I think some manufacturers should raise their minimums to try and keep the crap at bay. Although, those low minimums are what helped me get started.
I guess the best way to flush out the crap is to not buy it. Even if its cheap as shit. $10 blanks..? |
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| TenetSW |
| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 4:27 pm |
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Joined: 04 Dec 2004
Posts: 639
Location: on the outside looking in
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yeah what he said^
besides, i would put my neck on the line to say that most decks coming out of shops and small companys (mine for sure) are better than the shit wood from china with pro skater Joe Blow's name on it ANDits providing jobs here for people who don't support communism or the restriction of only one offspring per fam, or maybe they DO, but atleast they have that right.
oops gotta edit: not just yeah what thrash said, but yeah what skinny said too!! |
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| skinny |
| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 4:53 pm |
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Joined: 12 Sep 2004
Posts: 2706
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If you want to support a pro buy a "Nixon" watch or a "black flys" t shirt.
In my utopia Bam Margera would be getting up to go skating and talk to kids about how good it is to ride for a COMPANY named "Element" he would in turn get a check that would pay for his car and his house. The board he is riding would say element 200 times on it instead of "him or Bam" He could still make enough money selling milk or Doritos or shoes or watches or his ass. The t.v. show he has should be why little boys and girls scream when they see him. Also why the fuck can G.S.D. re-issue a shitty re-pro 20 years after he finished sucking ass? For 80 dollars no less. Blair maybe the shop decks are a good business dission for speed dealer. Thats what this all is a ruthless business operated so that little guys can't make a dollar. I am going to setup a new deck this week and just for you guys I won't print any graphics on it. |
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| slob-air |
| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 5:15 pm |
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Joined: 27 Oct 2001
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TenetSW - There's a ton of companies still making decks in America. Sadly many American companies are now doing their price point decks overseas - this is, in part, due to the shop deck phenominon (and in some cases, their own stupidity -- they started the shop deck bullshit).
I reject decks made in China -I don't believe they can make a great deck there -- even with Canadian maple. I don't believe these shop decks are great either -- many of them are made in China too.
This isn't good for skateboarding at all.
And yes, I have an old skate bro that runs the woodshop at Dwindle and he knows his shit better than anybody - my opinion on the matter has certainly driven a wedge in our relationship, sadly.
I support companies that make great decks. I support companies that promote skateboarding and sponsor deserving riders and help progress skateboarding. I support companies that realise that there's many facets to skateboarding. I support indie companies trying to do it right and serve the niches the larger companies overlook.
I do not, however, support shops slapping their logos on shit wood and selling them cheaper yet doubling their profit while slutting out the industry. They're not only hurting themselves in the long run, and they're hurting skateboarding.
Woodshops that are supplying shop decks are largly doing it out of desparation in an extremely competative industry. And that's sad.
We are just beginning to see the result of the China experiment. So far it's pretty damn ugly. |
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| TenetSW |
| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 5:40 pm |
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Joined: 04 Dec 2004
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| i can definately respect that, and sorry about your boy at dwindle |
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| slob-air |
| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 6:17 pm |
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I was talking to a bro that runs a distro that offers shop decks complete with slik screened graphics the other day. I told him my concerns and asked him this: Wouldn't you rather be selling Skateshop A 40 pro model decks rather than 40 shop decks?
He thought about it a while and realized that yes, indeed, he'd rather be doing that. The problem is teaching the shops they need to get on board with this too. Becuase ultimately, when 8 out of 10 decks in the local skatepark are shop decks, something is very, very wrong.
Woodshops supplying shop decks may be just trying to manage, and get by, and I can understand that, but they seem to lack the foresite to see they're only hurting themselves in the end -- just as those manufacturing in China are.
And if skateboard company A owns its own woodshop and is also making and distributing shopdecks, they're just cutting their own throat. |
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| skinny |
| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 6:24 pm |
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Joined: 12 Sep 2004
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Sorry? About his friend getting PAID? I bet he has no problem with the shop deck thing. Walmart doesn't carry shop decks.
Shop decks keep skateboarding alive, when skateshops are making good profits, they are more willing to buy new product lines. The decks keep low budget skateboarders skating, keeping the need for shoes, trucks,wheels and clothes going. Sure the decks themselves are a joke. For a shop its win win they get advertizing, a steady base of kids coming in for new decks,(cause they have to a shop deck lasts an everyday skateboarder 2 weeks). It also enables a shop to start a team easily. The profits are not as good as most people assume. Usually the shops get them for 12-20 bucks and sell them for around 20-25. I don't make shop decks, I just don't like anyone saying "Don't buy this cause a pro somewhere won't be able to pay for his 6th luxury car." So if you live in Canada or even Hawaii, just do yourself a favor and go skating or have a beer or whatever you do, just worry about something more important. |
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| TenetSW |
| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 6:53 pm |
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Joined: 04 Dec 2004
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@skinny
the sorry about his friend is over them having a riff. i'm sure he doesn't mind gettin paid, and thats why there's beef with slob... |
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| slob-air |
| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 7:03 pm |
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skinny wrote: Sorry? About his friend getting PAID? I bet he has no problem with the shop deck thing.
You're right, my bro is living the life!
However, my other bro sees it. He'd be better off selling pro decks -- less work more profit. He sees it now.
skinny wrote:
Walmart doesn't carry shop decks
Don't give them any ideas -- generic flameboy decks made in China aren't helping anyone.
skinny wrote:
Shop decks keep skateboarding alive, when skateshops are making good profits, they are more willing to buy new product lines.
No they don't. They are slowly killing it - especially with the crap China wood invading the market. With 8 out of 10 kids in the park riding shit decks, how long are they going to keep buying shit decks before they give up and quit?
Why would a shop buy new lines when their shop decks are flying out the door?
skinny wrote:
The decks keep low budget skateboarders skating, keeping the need for shoes, trucks,wheels and clothes going. Sure the decks themselves are a joke.
That's an illusion. Low budget boards tend to be shit boards that don't last a week. They'd be better off buying a quality board that lasts a month or more.
And kids will still buy wheels when they need them and trucks when they need them and shoes and shirts too-- just like we did in the '70s and '80s when there wasn't this explosion of shop decks.
skinny wrote:
For a shop its win win they get advertizing, a steady base of kids coming in for new decks,(cause they have to a shop deck lasts an everyday skateboarder 2 weeks). It also enables a shop to start a team easily.
It's not a win when the deck is shit and breaks after a week. It's not a win when there are no pros for the gromms to look up to, and be inspired by, or for the media to cover.
I think Pros are important -- though I think many should be cut loose. Many kids that get sponsored think they can rest on the laurels. Of course, on the other end of it, some great skaters have lost models simply because they platued -- that's not always a good thing either.
Yah, start a team they can profit off of while selling them discounted shit china decks to ride. No thanks.
skinny wrote:
The profits are not as good as most people assume. Usually the shops get them for 12-20 bucks and sell them for around 20-25.
Shop decks run $20 to $22 Canadian for decent wood and sell for $60. The shit china stuff comes a lot cheaper and still sells for $60.
I get offers weekly from Chinese distros - but I'm not interested. I won't sell garbage to skaters.
Pro decks run $40 to $50 and sell for $80 to $90
Selling kids shittier decks is never a good idea. |
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